[OneTwoWhatever]

Hi to all. Please try and be cool about some of the stuff below.

The original 2018 Fiesta ST in a number of regards had a little less performance then the i20 N. Hyundai was doing quicker 0-100s/0-60s and I would go as far as to say that the original Fiesta was struggling to be a 6.5 car due to grip limitations. A consistent 6.5 car at least. Even though obviously not always the i20 would often put itself between 6 and 6.5 while the Fiesta would rather seldom be over 6.5 even though under 7.0. Given the conditions are not awful for both vehicles.

Then the i20 could be a little faster while rolling too if you drop the gear correctly but it is true that locked in gear the Fiesta's torque would allow it to take off better. In terms of running quarter miles, it is close. Seems like the i20 starts better and could stay ahead enough with both drivers being on point, but the Fiesta would be running it down and would have the half mile won. But it would be close. Or the Fiesta can just take it. A possibility.

In terms of lap times the i20 N is ahead from the info you can find online and from what you see in the YouTube videos. The Fiesta can and has put up a better time if a track features big straights where it can stretch the same legs that help it to come back in straight-line racing.

Finally coming to the point. The facelifted Fiesta has 30 NMs of torque increase. The 0-100 claim has remained the same at 6.5 and I think it's Ford actually catching up to their promise. From a couple available YouTube videos testing this you could notice that now it probably should be consistently hitting it. But it is still likely not going under 6.5 too often which the i20 is capable of. My question is how that torque increase could affect the straight-line performance firstly. When it's not just getting from 0 to 100 but further on. Could it change the quarter mile situation since the Fiesta was already running down the i20? Could it help the Fiesta gain even more ground while already moving?

In addition to lower weight the extra cylinder and slightly bigger displacement are quite a big deal in terms of overall performance and judging from some graphs I was able to find online the i20 has the benefit of not just having a somewhat irrelevant couple of peak HPs over the Fiesta but simply more power through the range and earlier on. And the way I see it that has allowed it to be faster in those applications even though the Fiesta had a bit more peak torque available a little earlier. Could the increase from 15 to 45 NMs of difference change things around noticeably?

Really hoping for some quality analytical input. I hope we can all be rational. What do you people think?

And which one do you think is going to be a faster car on the actual streets overall all biases aside and everything?

Cheers.

 

[K3FUS]

To be frank….I don’t like either car much so don’t care much which is best of an average pair.

 

[KenL]

A faster car on the streets.

 

[AMc]

Well, you've answered that yourself already, it would appear. The i20N.

 

[MarkP80]

Splitting hairs over 0-60, 0-100 or standing 1/4 times doesn't, for me, make one car better than the other and certainly wouldn't make me choose one over the other.
What I do know is that if those criteria are what really interest you, then the ST is the no-brainer choice. It is easily, readily and relatively cheaply tuneable to 235-250hp, more for a little more money. Many tuners have remaps for the car and tuning parts are widely available.
Last time I read, the i20N ECU has not been cracked, so you would need to use a piggy-back tuning box which is not ideal (and only gets you 220hp-ish). Tuning parts for the i20N are few and far between and are expensive.
So if it's hp, torque and performance you're after, then it's ST all the way, with an easy bit of tuning.
And the ST will get its power down fine with the LSD. An uprated torque mount helps though, if you're keen on thrashing it off the line.

And which one do you think is going to be a faster car on the actual streets

- I would like to think no-one would be driving on the streets in a manner where these performance differences are relevant.

 

[mightbemeangreen]

What a childish first and possibly only post ! Must surely be posted by a 15 year old with nothing much better to do ? Maybe instead of racing on the streets , stick to your PC pal. Oh, and if you want consistency doing acceleration times, maybe get a Tesla dull thing, it takes the need for any driver skill away, so would probably suit you to a tee....

 

[OneTwoWhatever]

@AMc Not really, this is quite an open question, I think.

@MarkP80 Great reply, yes, the aftermarket scene is way more active for the ST.

@mightbemeangreen An expected unpleasant reaction even though surely unnecessary.

 

[fa13sta]

Hi to all. Please try and be cool about some of the stuff below.

The original 2018 Fiesta ST in a number of regards had a little less performance then the i20 N. Hyundai was doing quicker 0-100s/0-60s and I would go as far as to say that the original Fiesta was struggling to be a 6.5 car due to grip limitations. A consistent 6.5 car at least. Even though obviously not always the i20 would often put itself between 6 and 6.5 while the Fiesta would rather seldom be over 6.5 even though under 7.0. Given the conditions are not awful for both vehicles.

Then the i20 could be a little faster while rolling too if you drop the gear correctly but it is true that locked in gear the Fiesta's torque would allow it to take off better. In terms of running quarter miles, it is close. Seems like the i20 starts better and could stay ahead enough with both drivers being on point, but the Fiesta would be running it down and would have the half mile won. But it would be close. Or the Fiesta can just take it. A possibility.

In terms of lap times the i20 N is ahead from the info you can find online and from what you see in the YouTube videos. The Fiesta can and has put up a better time if a track features big straights where it can stretch the same legs that help it to come back in straight-line racing.

Finally coming to the point. The facelifted Fiesta has 30 NMs of torque increase. The 0-100 claim has remained the same at 6.5 and I think it's Ford actually catching up to their promise. From a couple available YouTube videos testing this you could notice that now it probably should be consistently hitting it. But it is still likely not going under 6.5 too often which the i20 is capable of. My question is how that torque increase could affect the straight-line performance firstly. When it's not just getting from 0 to 100 but further on. Could it change the quarter mile situation since the Fiesta was already running down the i20? Could it help the Fiesta gain even more ground while already moving?

In addition to lower weight the extra cylinder and slightly bigger displacement are quite a big deal in terms of overall performance and judging from some graphs I was able to find online the i20 has the benefit of not just having a somewhat irrelevant couple of peak HPs over the Fiesta but simply more power through the range and earlier on. And the way I see it that has allowed it to be faster in those applications even though the Fiesta had a bit more peak torque available a little earlier. Could the increase from 15 to 45 NMs of difference change things around noticeably?

Really hoping for some quality analytical input. I hope we can all be rational. What do you people think?

And which one do you think is going to be a faster car on the actual streets overall all biases aside and everything?

Cheers.

Might not be the best forum to ask which is the better car between a Ford and a Hyundai.. (read the room) 😆

I can tell you why I went for the Ford though - first of all, I've always liked Ford cars. They've had their ups and downs over the years, but Ford have always put a lot of effort into the handling of their cars. When they put their minds to it, they come up with some cracking hot hatches and have a long line of iconic cars to show for it.

Secondly, I did a lot of research when choosing my current car (Mk8 Fiesta ST).. the two things that swung it for me were a) as @MarkP80 mentioned, the availability of low-cost upgrades, and b) every car review I read put the Fiesta ST as the car to beat in terms of handling and driving enjoyment.

I'm assuming that by "faster car on the streets" you really mean quick on the open roads. To be honest, I think you'd enjoy either car. It's probably an idea to go to a few shows to see which one you like the most and go with that.

 

[AMc]

@AMc Not really, this is quite an open question, I think.

Well, yes. The facts are the facts.

As for whether it will actually be a noticeable difference, that's another question.

Such small differences in the real world will be null and void due to driver input/reactions. They're basically on a par.

That said, with the same inputs at the same times, the facts are the i20N would pip the Fiesta to the post.

Arguing against the facts is just a way of cinvincing yourself otherwise with some form of confirmation bias.

 

[mightbemeangreen]

@AMc Not really, this is quite an open question, I think.

@MarkP80 Great reply, yes, the aftermarket scene is way more active for the ST.

@mightbemeangreen An expected unpleasant reaction even though surely unnecessary.

"unpleasant" oh please, don't go all 'offended' on me , I would take a guess you do not even drive yet, and are quite possibly a schoolboy off school at home having a sickie. Seriously, NO adult posts such inane pontifications. There are far more important things in life and to owning a car than all that drivel you wrote ! Oh and by the way a car is also about how it makes you feel driving it, its interior, its looks etc , not just performance figures. Have you ever ridden a Mk1 Raleigh Chopper? not the best performing bike in the world, but when you rode it as a lad you felt on top of the world.

 

[Tsotsi8787]

If your chasing 0-62 times, you should probably just buy a faster car.

 

[Tsotsi8787]

What a childish first and possibly only post ! Must surely be posted by a 15 year old with nothing much better to do ? Maybe instead of racing on the streets , stick to your PC pal. Oh, and if you want consistency doing acceleration times, maybe get a Tesla dull thing, it takes the need for any driver skill away, so would probably suit you to a tee....

A bit harsh that, no? I bet you have him down as 3 door driver.

 

[mightbemeangreen]

A bit harsh that, no? I bet you have him down as 3 door driver.

its harsh.. BUT FAIR !! sometimes you have to say it as you see it and not pull your punches or be all liberal and touchy feely. No, not a 3dr driver, more like an E-scooter rider...

 

[AMc]

Or just stay on the topic and not berate other members, as per the code of conduct one agrees to when joining.

 

[Cat Power]

So it's down to which one looks the best in an owners eyes and perhaps taking into consideration any mods to improve its said looks ie lowering, skirts etc

 

[OneTwoWhatever]

@fa13sta I was ready to receive a bit of a backlash. But yeah, I hear you, I own a Fiesta ST MK8 right now and have test driven the i20 N last winter. Right now you could say I have both options on the table. The facelift or the Korean. Because the MK8 I have was bought used and I am looking to freshen up with a brand-new car before everything goes electric. Not like it's a bad thing though. Electric racing categories are proving that the future might not be all boring.

@AMc Yeah, but that is the whole point of my question. Could the extra torque in the facelift tip the scales? Between the base cars obviously. Because surely 30 is not nothing if your input is on point and you don't just go ham on the pedal spinning and hopping. Or maybe that 30 simply exists in the area where the Fiesta was already better without addressing the other side of things. I am not mechanically illiterate, but without an actual dyno chart it's a guessing game for me.

@mightbemeangreen You are embarrassing yourself right now, please chill out.

@Tsotsi8787 Never said that I care for the straight line more than for other elements. Obviously would not have been in the market for anything like these two if going through the bends wasn't the biggest rush I can get in a car. But I don't find it strange to care about acceleration even in a car with a whole set of other strong aspects. Nothing wrong with it in my opinion. It is a balance of everything after all. A lot of the roads are straight and there are practical applications to straight line quickness.

@Cat Power Yeah, I kind of enjoy the facelift's look to be honest. I wonder what the consensus on it is in the community.

 

[Tsotsi8787]

mk8.5…

 

[KenL]

Hi to all. Please try and be cool about some of the stuff below.

The original 2018 Fiesta ST in a number of regards had a little less performance then the i20 N. Hyundai was doing quicker 0-100s/0-60s and I would go as far as to say that the original Fiesta was struggling to be a 6.5 car due to grip limitations. A consistent 6.5 car at least. Even though obviously not always the i20 would often put itself between 6 and 6.5 while the Fiesta would rather seldom be over 6.5 even though under 7.0. Given the conditions are not awful for both vehicles.

Then the i20 could be a little faster while rolling too if you drop the gear correctly but it is true that locked in gear the Fiesta's torque would allow it to take off better. In terms of running quarter miles, it is close. Seems like the i20 starts better and could stay ahead enough with both drivers being on point, but the Fiesta would be running it down and would have the half mile won. But it would be close. Or the Fiesta can just take it. A possibility.

In terms of lap times the i20 N is ahead from the info you can find online and from what you see in the YouTube videos. The Fiesta can and has put up a better time if a track features big straights where it can stretch the same legs that help it to come back in straight-line racing.

Finally coming to the point. The facelifted Fiesta has 30 NMs of torque increase. The 0-100 claim has remained the same at 6.5 and I think it's Ford actually catching up to their promise. From a couple available YouTube videos testing this you could notice that now it probably should be consistently hitting it. But it is still likely not going under 6.5 too often which the i20 is capable of. My question is how that torque increase could affect the straight-line performance firstly. When it's not just getting from 0 to 100 but further on. Could it change the quarter mile situation since the Fiesta was already running down the i20? Could it help the Fiesta gain even more ground while already moving?

In addition to lower weight the extra cylinder and slightly bigger displacement are quite a big deal in terms of overall performance and judging from some graphs I was able to find online the i20 has the benefit of not just having a somewhat irrelevant couple of peak HPs over the Fiesta but simply more power through the range and earlier on. And the way I see it that has allowed it to be faster in those applications even though the Fiesta had a bit more peak torque available a little earlier. Could the increase from 15 to 45 NMs of difference change things around noticeably?

Really hoping for some quality analytical input. I hope we can all be rational. What do you people think?

And which one do you think is going to be a faster car on the actual streets overall all biases aside and everything?

Cheers.

My only quality, analytical input is that your post was so long I didn't read it all.

I would consider the i20N if they keep making it. I like how it looks and Hyundai is a reliable brand.

Welcome BTW.

 

[Twiddle]

The main issue here should be the looks. They are so similar in price, performance and spec it's barely worth talking about.
But the i20 (in my opinion) hideous looking both in and out and I'd choose pretty much anything else over it.

 

[Tsotsi8787]

I think it looks nice, especially in black, IMO. I would probably have one over the 8.5 as I’d feel I was getting more for my money with how much the Fez has gone up in price, even with all the cost cutting. The ol’ sentiment of, ‘pound for pound’, is no longer applicable IMO. That said, there is no way I’d swap my ST3 I have now though.