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Hi Marv,

Great news, only have to send 1 cooler back :)
and loads more room to mount just 1 cooler,
Couple of questions:
I've read loads of comments about having to rubber mount the cooler but space is still tight, are rubber mounts a necessity, I was looking at a couple of options.
1 weld some brackets down off the bumper, or
2 fabricate some brackets to come off the existing radiator shroud.
which would you think the better option.
thx
No you can solid mount it if you want. Mine is hard mounted with rubber gromits to reduce nvh, but the way my cooler mounts is to a threaded hole that's part of the coolers structure (due to being a bar and plate design) so it's in my best interest to reduce nvh.
Because you use a tube and fin design cooler, it's much lighter so has the mounting tabs on the ends. I solid mounted my old tube and fin pas cooler with no issues. But use your best judgement.

Pas cooler on the left.
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Discussion Starter · #682 ·
No you can solid mount it if you want. Mine is hard mounted with rubber gromits to reduce nvh, but the way my cooler mounts is to a threaded hole that's part of the coolers structure (due to being a bar and plate design) so it's in my best interest to reduce nvh.
Because you use a tube and fin design cooler, it's much lighter so has the mounting tabs on the ends. I solid mounted my old tube and fin pas cooler with no issues. But use your best judgement.

Pas cooler on the left.
View attachment 588308
Hi Marv
THx.
Compared to yours i've acres of space and looking at the picture below, I'm hoping I'll have room to retain the cold air feed through the bottom grille, which there was no room for which two coolers.
Grille Bumper Automotive exterior Gas Rectangle


I've got a remote "transit" reseviour, its got a thick pipe which goes from the reseviour to the pump and a thin pipe on the return.
Obviously its easier to cut the return as its an AN10 pipe which will fit the cooler connections without adapters or restrictions, but would it be better to cool the feed to the pump, or does it not make any difference ?
thx
 

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Hi Marv
THx.
Compared to yours i've acres of space and looking at the picture below, I'm hoping I'll have room to retain the cold air feed through the bottom grille, which there was no room for which two coolers.
View attachment 588309

I've got a remote "transit" reseviour, its got a thick pipe which goes from the reseviour to the pump and a thin pipe on the return.
Obviously its easier to cut the return as its an AN10 pipe which will fit the cooler connections without adapters or restrictions, but would it be better to cool the feed to the pump, or does it not make any difference ?
thx
AN10 is circa 16mm ID. The smaller return pipe on the pas system is 10mm ID. You'll need AN10 to 10mm barb fittings. Which you can only get in a straight fitting.
If you want an angle then you'll need to get 2 AN10 female to AN6 male adapters to then run angled AN6 to 10mm barb adaptes.

That was a bit of a mouthful. But once you start looking into fittings you'll see what I mean.
I used an AN10 cooler because its what I already had (was going to be the oil cooler before I found a bar and plate I could trust), I ended up spending the same amount in fittings as just buying a cooler with 10mm barbs.
 

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Discussion Starter · #684 ·
AN10 is circa 16mm ID. The smaller return pipe on the pas system is 10mm ID. You'll need AN10 to 10mm barb fittings. Which you can only get in a straight fitting.
If you want an angle then you'll need to get 2 AN10 female to AN6 male adapters to then run angled AN6 to 10mm barb adaptes.

That was a bit of a mouthful. But once you start looking into fittings you'll see what I mean.
I used an AN10 cooler because its what I already had (was going to be the oil cooler before I found a bar and plate I could trust), I ended up spending the same amount in fittings as just buying a cooler with 10mm barbs.
Hi Marv,
Yeah see what you mean.
But should put the cooler on the return as opposed to the feed to the pump ?
thx
 

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Discussion Starter · #685 ·
[
Hi Marv,
Yeah see what you mean.
But should put the cooler on the return as opposed to the feed to the pump ?
thx
Hi Marv,
After searching for over an hour bit more confused,
As you said I can go AN10 to AN6 adapter ( roughly 6 quid each then AN6 90 degree at roughly 10 quid each ) for the return
or
AN10 to AN12 adapter ( roughly 8 quid each ) then AN12 90 degree barb ( 15 quid each ) for the flow

Theres not a massive price difference, so is it better to do the flow or the return ?

THx
 

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I think the 10mm return pipe makes more sense. That's what mine has (got as a kit from Sico years ago), and most of the coolers I've ever seen. Then just two 90 degree barbs coming off the cooler (sounds like they'd be size AN6 from reading the above.) The connector I used to come off the original return pipe was just a bit of hollow aluminium rod (not flared or barbed) seems to do the job just fine and been on the car ages, something like 7 years.

I don't think it's that applicable in the PAS case, but I'd say the heat is generated inside the rack, so from that point of view it also makes sense to cool the return, although it probably doesn't matter too. With a big cooler the fluid will be pretty cool, mine barely gets warm. The OEM reservoir is pants though and still leaks through the cap so I've got a Transit one to fit at some point.
 

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[

Hi Marv,
After searching for over an hour bit more confused,
As you said I can go AN10 to AN6 adapter ( roughly 6 quid each then AN6 90 degree at roughly 10 quid each ) for the return
or
AN10 to AN12 adapter ( roughly 8 quid each ) then AN12 90 degree barb ( 15 quid each ) for the flow

Theres not a massive price difference, so is it better to do the flow or the return ?

THx
Wait.... What? If you wanted to split the feed line then you'd just use AN10 fittings to a -10 barb (AN10 hose width 15.4mm). I think you can look at it many different ways such as the pump is what suffers so cooling the feed would also benefit.
I just don't think it would benefit more than splitting the return. You have to consider hose size. With a 10mm ID hose you can route it a lot easier with little risk of kinking (especially with silicone). I imagine that's why all the kits are like that.
Also consider that you will likely have to buy more hose to run the slightly longer extra distance to a cooler (if you have a relocation kit). In which case you need fluro lined silicone hose which is dearer than regular silicone, and the larger the diameter, the greater the cost.
But I wouldn't be driven on cost as theres really not much in it. Do what makes your life easier. As it's not a track car, and likely hasn't ever boiled its pas. Pas boiling point is like 600 degrees. People commonly think their pas has boiled when it's just old. It has the same shelf life as oem type brake fluid, 2 years.
 

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I think you can look at it many different ways such as the pump is what suffers so cooling the feed would also benefit.
Just to clarify a potential ambiguity in terms, the "return" (from the rack) is also the "feed" ..to the pump, of course. So yeah, it does make sense to cool it after there. But the temperature rise across probably isn't enough to make a difference where it goes. I think that's what Alan was asking? As you say, from a practical perspective the smaller hose is also better.
 

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Just to clarify a potential ambiguity in terms, the "return" (from the rack) is also the "feed" ..to the pump, of course. So yeah, it does make sense to cool it after there. But the temperature rise across probably isn't enough to make a difference where it goes. I think that's what Alan was asking? As you say, from a practical perspective the smaller hose is also better.
The 10mm return from the rack feeds the bottle. Which in turn feeds the pump via the 16mm hose. You could argue the toss on temp differences between cooling before or after the bottle. But in real world terms space is a factor and the pas system really isn't bad enough to warrant such concerns.
If it was, you'd all be running hydro epas instead. As it costs less than a relocation kit and a cooler.
 
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Discussion Starter · #690 ·
The 10mm return from the rack feeds the bottle. Which in turn feeds the pump via the 16mm hose. You could argue the toss on temp differences between cooling before or after the bottle. But in real world terms space is a factor and the pas system really isn't bad enough to warrant such concerns.
If it was, you'd all be running hydro epas instead. As it costs less than a relocation kit and a cooler.
Hi Marv, Jimmy.
If as you both say the cooling benefit to the pump is negligable, then it makes no sense to re route the larger pipe, also I had a measure of the larger hose ID and it was closer to 20mm than 15, so would incur even more expensive fittings.
Thx for both your help :)
 

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Discussion Starter · #691 ·
Hi All,

Resisting the temptation to get power tools out as too many dimensions I don't know before the various fittings/adapters arrive

Want to "try" and make the cooler instalation look as OEM as possible, so will be retaining the lower rad deflector, drilling 20mm holes in it ( for the AN6 fittings to pass through), then using 20mm junction box cut oiut grommets to fill the gap ( hopefully it will look ok )

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As I've got the Maxton Front Splitter alread attached to the front bumper I've got loads of space to clamp the hoses to the bumper ( using P Clips ) to stop any danger of anything catching on the hoses while driving or NVH.

Automotive tire Bumper Wood Automotive exterior Motor vehicle


Roll on delivery on Tuesday :ROFLMAO:
 

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Hi Marv, Jimmy.
If as you both say the cooling benefit to the pump is negligable, then it makes no sense to re route the larger pipe, also I had a measure of the larger hose ID and it was closer to 20mm than 15, so would incur even more expensive fittings.
Thx for both your help :)
Somethings not right there then. As I had a 16mm ID fluro lined hose coming straight off the pump via a anembo engineering pump adapter. Which is what all the pas relocation kits use.
 
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Discussion Starter · #693 ·
Somethings not right there then. As I had a 16mm ID fluro lined hose coming straight off the pump via a anembo engineering pump adapter. Which is what all the pas relocation kits use.
Hi Marv,
I measured it last night by torchlight :ROFLMAO:

The adapter that comes off the pump is 19mm OD and the pipe just slides on really easy, I put the AN10 barb into the pipe and its proper loose.

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I'm not overly concerned as I'm not going to be cutting into this pipe now anyway.
Is it a possibility that the kit came with the wrong type of silicone hose for PAS ? and its softened ?
 

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Discussion Starter · #694 ·
Hi All,

Well the postman bought me some more bits :
Cooler rubber mounts
AN10 fittings

Before I'd opened them I was thinking how I'd send them back. I need 1 Torques AN10 90 degree barb for the breather plate. - THe rest are going back
But I was suprised how small the rubber mounts are, I'd dismissed using them due to percieved size, but on reflection I'm thinking of this :

Grille Motor vehicle Automotive lighting Automotive exterior Window


Cooler will be fully rubber mounted, spacing will need work but hopefully I can get the cooler to sit centrally in the grille appature

Metal arriving on Tuesday :)
 

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Hi Marv,
I measured it last night by torchlight :ROFLMAO:

The adapter that comes off the pump is 19mm OD and the pipe just slides on really easy, I put the AN10 barb into the pipe and its proper loose.

View attachment 588319

I'm not overly concerned as I'm not going to be cutting into this pipe now anyway.
Is it a possibility that the kit came with the wrong type of silicone hose for PAS ? and its softened ?
Who knows. Could be a tapered pipe. Oem pas lines commonly have flow restrictions. For the right reasons I assume. I just dont know why.
 
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Discussion Starter · #696 ·
Well,

Built up all the new coolant pipes earlier and thought id fit the junction box and egr plate.

About 30 seconds in - I spied the clutch hydraulic pipe, which I've got a new braided one to replace

one end
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the other

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Not the hardest pipe to change, but while I was looking saw the state of the gearbox earth cable

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So, job for tommorrow is to remove earth cable, clean up ancilliary earths, clean up the area they mount to and respray.
then I can get back to fitting the clutch pipe and coolant hoses.
Unless I find anything else :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:
 

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The adapter that comes off the pump is 19mm OD and the pipe just slides on really easy, I put the AN10 barb into the pipe and its proper loose.
Well yeah, you said the hose is 20mm ID. Sounds like it's too big. Pretty sure the kit I got is 16mm ID. (Edit - yep measured the pipe and it's 16mm ID, reservoir barb is 19mm as you say, fitted it dry and its tight, with a bit of fairy liquid it'll go on well)

The earths near the gearbox are a common high corrosion/ failure point for bad earths
 

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Discussion Starter · #698 ·
This car is driving me up the wall now.

Got one of the earth bolts out but the other is knackered ( angle grinder time )
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Not too stressed ( yes I am :ROFLMAO: )

If I can't get the bolt out once I've ground the head off I'll just use the other hole for all the earths

easy, oh no, cause someone decided to pass the pas pipe right over the top of the earth on the gearbox ( thankyou Mr Ford ) and use a really big bolt

Motor vehicle Automotive fuel system Vehicle Electrical wiring Automotive exterior


anyway, i've sprayed everything in wd40 so we'll see what tommorrow brings

One question :

How do you know if the engine / gearbox mounts are knackered ?
I've got powerflex inserts on all mounts, but they won't resurect a knackered mount will they ?

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More fun tommorrow :ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:
 

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Discussion Starter · #699 ·
Hi All

Couldn't wait

Pas bracket out - earth disconnected from gearbox
Grinder out - cut head off earth cable to shell

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sure the bolt will come out with a bit of heat, then I can clean up and paint the bracket.
and then back round to changing the pipes I started with :eek:
 

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Discussion Starter · #700 ·
Hi All,

Well I thought i'd annoy the neighbours a bit more with a stripping disk on the angle grinder, but theres a load of rust I cant get to, so thinking nitomores for a day, then wire brush in a drill and hopefully that should clean it up

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